Dave Cameron picks the Twins to take Lee

[JosephC]

http://www.ussmariner.com/2010/06/14/trading-cliff-lee/


this one I can buy... Twins are my second favorite team in MLB and he is right about them having a good farm system so that they can afford to make a good run at the playoffs this year. With Cliff Lee, no doubt they would be one of the most feared teams after the trading deadline. It could be a win-win for two teams... one that has everything going for them, and another that has everything going against them. The Twins no doubt have some of the best major league ready talent, and if Jack Z doesn't go after major league ready talent, he's gonna fall flat on his round face and make it less round. In other words, he won't be around to see it.

Your thoughts? What team do you think Cliff Lee will be headed to?
Yankees? Twins? Mets? Tampa Bay?

[Igoe4Mariners]

Makes sense to me. I brought this up in a thread earlier this year. They make about the most sense to me and they have some very appealing prospects. Their catcher is being blocked by Joe Mauer so he would be a great trading piece to start with and we could build a package around him. The Twins also lack that elite ace and I think Cliff Lee could put them over the top.

[clarknova]

I read that article. I'm not a huge fan of Dave Cameron's either (mostly because I'm not a huge fan of arrogance), but I've read just about every article and blog he's written in the last 4 years. Just as I'm not a huge fan of Geoff Baker's (same issue with the arrogance), but I read his stuff daily as well. I've gone to USSMariner gatherings, and I can say that I would recommend them highly to ANY local M's fan. You can interact with the Mariners brain trust and hear them speak the way they'd speak to a room full of baseball nerds, not the media. It's quite different, and very insightful. Dave Cameron is extremely knowledgeable, and definitely knows what he's talking about, he's just "nerd cocky". He's like that Saturday Night Live character played by Jimmy Fallon- the computer tech that's completely exasperated with everyone's ignorance, which is why after 4 years of reading his blog, I have yet to post one comment. The Liriano rumor was legit, and the blog he wrote merely stated that the M's were "kicking the tires" on Liriano. His point was that even after acquiring Cliff Lee, the M's were still in the hunt for a good starter. It was also right around this time that Liriano began to show why the Twins didn't end up trading him. Cameron usually steers clear of posting rumors, which is kind of a bummer for me, because I don't usually get that disappointed when it doesn't work out. I like to see what the team is trying to do. He has been wrong on players before, because what he lacks in rumor mongering, he makes up for in "talent scouting". Langerhans is a good example. He was big on Langerhans, and very proud of the fact that the M's went after him after he brought it up. Langerhans is not a bad bench guy, but that's all he'll ever be. The big one for me was always Snell. Cameron was practically begging for Ian Snell last year before we traded for him. Just goes to show that even the "smartest" baseball guys are wrong all the time. Front office, bloggers, reporters... All the time, (I however, am never wrong, and also very humble).

I digress. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say my gut tells me it won't be the Twins. Not that I don't want it to be. Wilson Ramos- the blocked catcher in the Twins organization, is the player from another organization I'd like to see in an M's uniform more than any other. He's also their best and most valuable prospect. Given the fact that the Twins are a smaller market team that doesn't exactly throw money at everyone not named Mauer, I don't see them doing a sign and trade. Without an extension, I would be totally (and very pleasantly) surprised to see them deal Ramos for the rest of one season of Lee, the post season, and a couple draft picks. His value is just that high. I've heard the Twins name out there from the beginning, and mostly because from an organizational standpoint, it's an excellent fit. I just don't see it. I wouldn't be surprised to see a three way trade that nets us a major league, or major league ready middle of the rotation starter, and a couple prospects from two different teams. I guess the teams that I see pushing for him the hardest are the larger market, higher payroll teams, but most of those (Dodgers, Mets) don't have strong farm systems and lack the depth and major league ready talent that Jack is going to seek. That said, if the M's can get Ramos for Lee, I'd take that any way I could get it. That's just my opinion though. Dave Cameron seems to think we could start with Ramos and get a few more guys. He may be right, he's smarter than I am- I guess I'd just be surprised.
Regarding Wilson Ramos- I think that regardless of what happens with Cliff Lee, the M's need to try to pry that guy out of Minnesota. He's one of the, if not the best catching prospect in baseball now that Weiters is up, and as Igoe4Mariners stated- totally blocked. There has been talk that due to knee issues, Mauer will eventually switch to 3rd or something like that, but that's what 2-3 years out at the earliest. This kid is ready to play now. Let's not let him go to someone else.

[Igoe4Mariners]

Great post Clarknova. I swear you would make a great blogger. Anyways, Cameron mentions in that post that Ramos would just be another Adam Moore type. Last I checked Ramos was one of the top prospects in baseball while Moore was a mediocre prospect in our system for a while. I would be absolutely stoked to get Ramos, so we could keep Moore as a back-up and get rid of Rojo "passball" Johnson.

[clarknova]

There are some rumblings this morning that it is the Twins, and that a deal may actually be close (7-10 days). Take this with a SERIOUS grain of salt. I have no source article, just speculation based on comments made by Buster Olney on ESPN radio this morning. This could be total speculation by him because of what he sees as far as a fit, but he seems to be making it seem like there's more to it than that. Hopefully I am proven wrong (above), and we get some quality prospects from the Twins.
The dumbest rumor I've heard is the Rangers. I've seen people talk about how stupid Jack would be to trade Lee to a division rival, but I don't get that at all. I think it would be the smartest thing he could do! There's no way the Rangers can resign Cliff Lee after this season- they're bankrupt and he's going to want somewhere between 85 and 100 million dollars. We'd be taking top of the system talent away from a powerful team in our division, that we would control for years. If anyone would be crazy to trade in that situation it'd be the Rangers. We need to take the best package offered, and if it's inter-divisional, all the better!
The only way he ever resigns with the Mariners, EVER, is if we outbid everyone else. The only way that happens is if the M's take their payroll back up. We'd need to expand it to $120+ million a year, and if we're going to spend that much money, we're NOT going to buy pitching. Enjoy Cliff Lee in an M's uniform this season. He's a great guy, and an all time great pitcher. He will never pitch for the M's again, but I have to think I'll root for the guy- as long as he's not a Yankee. I can't root for anything Yankees. I have sworn a blood oath to despise everything Yankees until I die.

[Igoe4Mariners]

Seeing Cliff Lee in a Rangers uniform would suck, but it would make it better if we got some of those top prospects in return.

[Jared]

I really hope Lee ends up in Minnesota if we deal him at the deadline. I'd love to see the Twins win a World Series because I'm also a big fan of them too. We had better land a boatload of stuff for him though because Lee is one of the best in the game and the O's got a shit load of stuff from us and we only landed Erik Bedard.

Z-man, do us all a solid and get us some talent.